Well if it was a month ago I would have said I had it all figured out BUT my wife and I have made tortillas several times and found we had a difficult time pressing the tortillas. Come to find out I was not using a fine enough grind. I have ordered some parts for my dehydrator and after working out the kinks in the drying process plan on updating my entire write-up. I don’t mind sending you what I have if you use fine corn flour in your mix. Everything else then would be the same except the drying process of the kernels. If you want just let me know.
I can tell you that the corn has to be dry, meaning if you take a dried kernel and hit it with a hammer it will shatter. Then it is dry enough. Actual % of moisture around the 10%. I have plugged up the stones on the Mockmill because the corn was not dry enough.
My last attempt I used a burr grinder and found the corn still had some moisture inside, it would have made a mess of the Mockmill, trust me you don’t want to go there.
It will probably be a couple of weeks before I am finished and I will post on the forum in reader’s recipes.
I did not like using wet masa for tortillas as using my whole grain corn flour for additions took an hour of letting it absorb before continuing. By the time we were ready to eat we were 3 sheets to the wind. I had some issues with grinding fine enough and getting it dry enough and am working on it now. Will post the process in the forum when I know it is correct, probably in a couple of weeks from now.
If you want what I have I can share but you would need to use fine flour in your mix.
That’s super helpful. I am not going to go through the trouble of drying out my nixtamal. I will continue trying to perfect grinding it in my food processor.
This article just appeared in the New York Times cooking section. He’s lauding fresh ground popcorn as more flavorful and textured in comparison to storebought nixtamal and masarepa flour (not compared to what you two are doing with whole corn).
“So he tried boiling regular supermarket popcorn in a pressure cooker before passing it through a hand-crank grain mill and kneading it with a bit of water into masa. The flavor and texture was outstanding.”
Interesting article appreciate the link. Although he did mention adding water to get the mix correct. I found just the opposite as it was too wet. Will have Diane read through the article as she went to Med school in the DR and has a bit of knowledge on the different Latin foods and the dough consistencies (she actually said that she thought my flour was too coarse for tortillas.) Don’t think she has made empanadas at least can’t remember, but that isn’t unusual, EACH YEAR GETS WORSE!.
Interesting to try though but I do remember it was kind of messy, the wet grinding that is. Everything I have ever read is absolutely not to use popcorn, so I guess considering this article and the fact others have said you can’t IS ALL THE reason to give it a whirl.
BTW I just received my dehydration filter paper yesterday and finished modifying my dehydrator with a fan (for faster drying times.) Hopefully over the next couple of days I’ll get some testing done for drying the corn properly.
Have to try this flour & corn mix and with the sourdough even sounds more interesting.
You made the comment " Using only home-milled un-nixtamalized corn is not a viable option for tortillas."
Because of non-nixtamalized or home-milled? You tried it?
Our first excursion into tortillas was from this on “Mexican Please.” Maybe it was the home-milled (not fine enough) flour as an additive I was using caused our issues but the outcome was definitely not like portrayed in the article.
I believed it was due to the non-nixtamalized nature of the cornmeal. No matter what wetness I went with, I couldn’t get the dough to hold together.
But thinking about what I’ve learned from your recent posts, I think my finely milled corn flour probably had way more bran than the nixtamalized corn flour I’ve since bought. So I think I should sift next time and see if I can get unnixtamalized but sifted fresh-milled corn flour to glue together enough to make a tortilla.
As I am ready to nixtamalize another batch I will take 1/2 and sift also and see if that helps. Us Gringos keep trying to perfect what the Latins have been doing for a thousand years, LOL, I watch their videos and are amazed. EVENTUALLY we will figure it out, screw up enough and we will get it.
When speaking to a friend in Florida about this issue he had taken a motorcycle trip to Mexico some years ago (when it was safe to do so) and had the experience of eating with a Mexican family, He watched her grind the whole grain corn against A ROCK and make her flour. She added some salt and water and hand pressed out the torillas. The best he had ever eaten. The reason I mention is he said it was whole kernel corn, she had dried in the sun after soaking (no freakin dehydrator for her ). These people have the feel for all this.
This reminds me of my mom’s sun dried tomatoes. Tomatoes from her garden set on baking sheets on our balcony, and I have never tasted any as good as hers since.
We have tomatoes LITERALLY coming out of our ears. Diane made some cheese polenta (from homemilled corn) and topped it with whole Cherry ripe tomatoes. OMG…between the fresh cheese polenta and the sweet tomatoes!!!
I am beginning to think from some research and looking at some “Mexican Experts” the issues with hydrating the dough are all with the flour. None I have seen over the past couple of days let their dough sit to hydrate, even those making grinding wet and adding Maseca. It has to be the flour and how fine it has to be. It also may be processed so the parts that take time to hydrate are removed. Look on your package and see if it has to be refrigerated. If not it has to be rolled with parts of the kernel removed.
For me with the home milled (coarser grind) it was imperative to let it rest an hour to hydrate. I hope this new batch turns out differently. Also the dough using the fine flour which they call instant seems to take on a much different texture and I observed. I attempted to find some research on the process for the Maseca but info is limited.
Melissa, I had the opportunity today to mix 100g of finely ground whole grain Nixtamal with 150g of hot water for your Sourdough-Corn-Rosemary Bread. While waiting for the corn to cool I decided to press some tortillas. Below are my observations
First the corn absorbed 10g more water than the coarser grind, I used the first time. The dough was soft, pliable and stuck together well. After an hour the dough which was covered had the same consistency. So my observation of requiring an hour to let the corn absorb water WAS NOT needed with the fine grind.
I used wet hands to handle the 60g pieces of dough for the tortilla, rolled in a ball and placed a large dimple in the center. Placed a good size dab of water in the dimple and folded the dough over on it and re-rolled. Pressed into a 5" disc and easily removed the plastic. I actually manhandled the tortilla a bit to see how well it stuck together and it did. No splitting. I was lucky to get the plastic off my past tortillas. I pressed one shortly after making the dough and an hour later to see if there was any change. There was not.
The hydration rate is DOUBLE what I have been using. The texture of the dough is much different, more of a plasticky feel when playing with it.
It appears from this that the fine flour is required and whole grain is not an issue. Drying of course is important so that is next as I am now set up to try again using a different method.
I realize that all corn varieties will be different and a little playing with the variety will be necessary. I could not believe how much liquid it soaked up without getting sticky.
8/15/20; Tonight made my first PERFECT corn tortillas. They were a dream to make and Diane absolutely could not cook them faster than I could press them. They turned out soft, did not crack, they were a pleasure to make. I could actually man-handle them to the grill.
Whole grain home milled (very fine) Nixtamalized Dent corn:
419g hot water (176% hydration)
238g of Nixtamal (will make about 8+ – 60g tortiilla balls)
1 tsp salt
Final texture similar to very soft play dough. I cut and rolled all at one time. Placed in covered container with wet paper towel over and when she was ready (about an hour later) I wet my fingers removed each, pressed down to make a rough circle without any cracks, made a dimple in the middle and placed a good dab of water, then folded the dough ball over the water and re-rounded. Placed in the press and perfecto!!
So interesting. And I’m so happy for you and Diane that you achieved your perfect tortillas! I’m sorry it took me so long to respond.
I didn’t know I should dimple the tortilla dough ball and put a drop of water in the dimple, fold around it, and the roll/press. Do you know why this last minute hydration addition is done?
I checked my bag of masa harina and it doesn’t say to refrigerate, though I see flecks in there and I do refrigerate. My googling says,
" According to the Whole Grains Council, masa harina is not labeled “whole grain” because of the process that’s used to make the flour. … The thought is that some of the corn is lost when the liquid is drained, but the Council says the loss is so minimal that the end product is very close to a whole grain flour."
I am going to take a stab at the “dab of water” in the middle. I have only seen one person make tortillas using that method (Views on the Road) and have seen many others that do not do it. SUPPOSEDLY if the Masa is made properly (and my bet cooked properly) the tortilla will puff up. All the videos I have seen they did this. Last night my tortillas turned out perfect again but only one puffed up. I don’t think Diane has the heat right yet but I am only guessing.
If they are left on the pan too long it boils out the excess moisture and they don’t puff up? I keep thinking this little extra bit of moisture is to help the tortilla to puff, but at this point it is just a guess.
Yesterday I had made the Masa a couple of hours before I needed it and the dough needed a bit more hydration than the 176% I started with as it was cracking. With wet hands I reformed the balls but my guess is my dab of water was sucked up into the dough.
EVENTUALLY we will get them to puff up but in the mean time they taste really good.
I’ll definitely try the drop of water next time and see if I get puffiness. I’d imagine with a flour tortilla that would be even more likely. And could I guarantee pita-pocketing of my naan if I do this?
Hey Meliisa! Did a bit of research on the net and it seems the cook heat and moisture have something to do with the puffing. Yes this may also help with your naan also. I will definitely try on naan and tortillas the next time. I copied this out of Quora it seemed the most relevant.
"the trick is to have a really hot comal or thin pan. For corn tortillas, I have a 1$ mister bottle, hit each side of the tortilla with spray, put the tortilla on the comal. You want the heat high enough to puff the tortilla and toast it just a little brown in spots. Too high can burn it too quickly. Watch the cook, try to flip only once. After the first flip is when most of the puff occurs.
For flour tortillas, similar, I usually don’t spray them. The toasted spots are the best taste. Most tortilla are not cooked when you buy them. I didn’t realize that at first.
A comal is a pan or surface used to heat/toast the tortilla. The best in Mexico are shallow “pans” made of clay, about 1/2″ thick, various diameters; street food ones about 16in. Often used over charcoal. In use, the top surface is coated with lime. That helps keep food from sticking.
A thin steel pan works too at home, or a griddle, but it needs to be hot, a little hotter than I like for teflon. I recently bought for $3 or $4 a round “comal” at 99centOnly store. It is coated steel, about the thickness of a good quality steel cookie sheet (.035in, actually). It’s round, 11in. in diameter. I can do 3 corn tortillas at a time on it."
I believe my Diane is cooking them too long actually drying them out. The last batch did break awful easy compared to others we made in the past.
I tried the approach of dimpling the dough, filling it with water, folding the dough around it, and then pressing. I think the tortillas maybe did come out more bubbly on the surface as a result. Here are a couple of pics.
The filling was sauteed onion, bell pepper, jalapeño pepper, zucchini (because I have too many in my garden), tofu (Chipotle does that and it’s tasty) and taco seasoning.
I had some issues with grinding fine enough and getting it dry enough and am working on it now. Will post the process in the forum when I know it is correct, probably in a couple of weeks from now.
on your dehydration filter paper and fan modifications
