Your total flour is 300g. So for a final hydration of 85% the total water should be 255g.
You’re pre-fermenting 90g flour at 65% hydration = 58.5g (59g rounding up). So that 59g must come from the total water.
What you have left for the main dough is…
210g flour
196g water
6g salt
149g levain
But as always add the 196g slowly till the dough feels right. The method i’d use is…
Mix the flour and salt together. Set aside.
In another bowl add the levain and most of the water.
Break the levain up in water the best you can.
Then add the flour and form the dough.
While you are forming the dough add the water you set aside slowly, bit by bit, till a nice dough is formed.
Then knead till full gluten formation etc…
Better to work your way up to the right hydration and stop when the dough feels right. Don’t add in the water all at once.
Make sure it taps hollow. This is a very high hydrated dough with einkorn and buckwheat to-boot. Will take longer to bake than other kinds of breads.
Thank you @Abe,
My math has been wrong all along, I don’t count the levain (and many bakers don’t, Chad R doesn’t), so I calculated my 85% for final dough using 210g of flour for final dough.
Thank you,
A
A levain is flour and water and consists of a large percentage of prefermented flour from the total recipe. A levain must always be included when working out the final hydration of the dough. If using a few grams of starter then I can see why but levains can be very high. I’m sure Chad and all bakers take this into consideration even if they don’t tell you when giving over the recipe.
Hamelman gives the overall recipe, before anything is pre-fermented, and gives the final hydration including percentages. He then details another chart with the levain build taken from the total flour and water with percentages as well. Finally he gives a chart for the final dough. But the hydration is always correctly worked out when including the total flour and water. Chad might not tell you this but it’s all done for you when working out a good hydration for the dough. IMO Hamelman is the authority when it comes to this.
Only question is if you have been going about this differently have you actually been ending up with an 85% hydrated dough? I’m not sure how it can be worked out any differently.
I will do my best to follow your recipe and calculations religiously
BTW,
I just checked another recipe given to me from this forum, a sprouted Spelt recipe and the levain is not part of the total calculation of flour as below, the recipe is 73% hydration for sprouted Spelt:
450g flour
333ml h2o
150 levain (100% hydration)
If I follow your math, this should be a 77% hydration instead.
In Chad’s book, he mentioned that they normal have many different levains going at different hydration and therefore it is not calculated as part of the total flour.
I have seen both, some bakers counted toward the overall total of flour and others don’t. I admit that I normally have a hard time following a recipe and go off with my feeling at the moment. I normally don’t count the levain as part of the total flour. However, since I am working with your recipe, I will follow it to my best ability.
Thank you,
A
Yes… If you look at my recipe i’ve done the same thing. It’s the layout of the final dough section. Their recipes just haven’t shown you the breakdowns done in the two preceeding charts. The overall recipe and levain build. However when working out the final hydration (which actually hasn’t been done in the recipe you’ve given it’s just shown the flour + water + salt + levain) everything will be included. Many recipes gloss over and just show the final dough. But ask Chad what the total hydration is he’ll do a calculation taking the levain into consideration.
@anh when I steam my oven I lose a lot of heat. So I bake all my breads at the highest it goes at 230°C (446°F) without the fan. Once the oven spring is finished then for the last 10-15 minutes I switch the fan on and stop the steam for a nice crust. Then carefully remove the loaf from the pan and return to the oven for a nice all over crust. This is just a method that works for my oven. Yours might be different.
I think you’re asking what temp I bake the not-pan loaf sprouted spelt bread?
Preheat oven and baking vessel to 500F.
Load the dough and bake lid on 20 minutes.
Drop the oven temp to 450F, bake another 10 minutes.
Remove the lid, bake another 10 minutes.
If using cast iron, I might drop the oven temp to 475F as soon as I load the dough, and then continue as I wrote, additionally adding a baking sheet under the cast iron about halfway thru to prevent burning of the base of the bread.
@anh 20 minutes with steam then 10-15 minutes without, until you can remove the bread from the pan, after which carefully remove from the pan and return to the oven until there’s a nice all over golden crust.
I baked both recipes, waited and sliced the loaves. I cannot say the crumbs are any better than what I did previously without the inclusions.
I posted a crumb shot of my pan loaf the other without the inclusions, if you look at that and the pan loaf of this recipe, the crumb shots aren’t different. @Fermentada,
I still have the gummy issue, like a few others on this forum has when using sprouted grains.
Thank you both for your help, I am going to have to do this trials and errors on my own. I red that the gluten is compromised during the sprouting process and this maybe the reason. There may not be much that I can do about the gummy issue
The first two pictures are from the recipe of Abe and the last is from the Sprouted Spelt recipe.
A
@anh it might be something that due to the flours being used is just the nature of the bread. Are you including and bread flour? If so, which brand and how high is the protein percentage?
Hi Abe,
That is what I am trying to avoid, bread flour. I am have been trying different ways to prevent the gummy issue. Other than the gummy issue, I have excellent flavor. Even the one that I posted earlier this week with inclusions, dense, with excellent flavor.
Melissa can get really good result with sprouted Spelt, I followed the recipe and I still get the gummy issue.
I believe the gluten is damaged during the sprouting process, how the sprouted grains are dry, as well as the fermentation stage all have to do with the outcome of the bake goods.
I will slowly backup the sprouted grains and add non-sprouted grains, I will get there eventually.
I really appreciate the efforts you both put in to help me, @Abe and @Fermentada
A
While I don’t have suggestions to offer regarding your method, if I were getting gummy results, here’s what I would try:
When finished baking, leave the bread on a rack in the turned-off oven (remove from loaf pan/Dutch oven/clay baker if using) and prop the oven door open an inch or so with a wooden spoon (or some other utensil). Let the bread cool that way, probably taking several hours. Then put the bread in a cabinet and forget about it for at least 24 hours before cutting into it. I do this now with whole grain rye breads to prevent gumminess. Not sure it would work for your bread, but it’s worth a try.
The lid traps the steam created by the dough as it heats up. This let’s the dough keep expanding / keeps the crust from setting prematurely. The timing works out pretty perfectly for steam running out, crust crisping up, lid coming off. That’s why baking bread in a ceramic baker or dutch oven is so popular.
Your breads look good. I agree with @Arlo48 about letting them bake as long as possible, and cool and set as long as possible too. Getting the inside up past 208F / 98C is a good target for rye, probably applicable to other grains too. The bread sometimes needs to dry out more
@Arlo48 and @Fermentada,
I have been doing the partially open oven door. Although the bread has completely cooled down by the time we slice it, I noticed the gummy issue is improved the following day. So perhaps, a 24-hour wait period required.
Thank you all,
A
