I’ve only used olive oil in the recipe.
Oh perfect! (Though I did remember that I have some lard in my fridge)
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I make hard rolls weekly , but they are like the ones you can buy in Germany. Besides freezing well for weeks they also reheat to a nice crunchy crust. Maybe you want to try them.
3 1/2 cup unbleached AP flour
1 Tbsp dry yeast ( instant )
1 1/2 Tsp. salt
1 Tbsp oil ( any ) I use Canola most of the time
1 1/4 cup water
combine everything by hand or by machine into a smooth dough. If too stiff feel free to add a little more water.
Place in greased bowl and let rise until double. For bigger holes use the fold method 3x.Turn out onto counter and divide dough into 12 pieces. Shape into balls and let sit on counter for 20 minutes.
Cover a baking sheet ( I use an oven liner ) with a bit of Semolina , Corn flour or Potato flour. Flatten the balls and stretch each one slightly into an oblong and dipping the bottom into semolina , corn flour, or potato flour before placing it on the baking sheet. Let rise again for 30 minutes. Covered with plastic.
Heat oven to 425 degree on convection.
When rolls are ready slash top with a Lam or razor blade spray with water, especially the cut and place in middle of oven for appr. 20 minutes.
A picture of the finished rolls is on the bakers forum
I don’t know if you are still using the forum but I will just hope you are. I need some information on a post about new york hard rolls. I would like to talk with you.
Thanks
daf
I certainly hope so too. And I hope you’re using the forum as well @daf - I want to know if that recipe @sberch posted is anything like the “real thing”
@daf, similar to you I grew up in the NY metro area - northern NJ for me - and Taylor Ham, Egg and Cheese on a Hard roll with saltpepperketchup is forevever the breakfast of champions. Hell, when I was a teenager I’d have one for breakfast, or just a hard roll with butter, a turkey sandwich on a hard roll for lunch and usually an italian sub after school let out before mom made dinner 
I can tell you one thing for sure. I’m half your age and I left the area 15 years ago and I can say that you could still get those good crispy, flaky, chewy, airy hard rolls at plenty of delis and bagel shops. It still exists.
Anyhow, that elusive roll… I’ve been all over the internet looking and you’ve turned up all the same recipes I have and seem like you’ve read all the same old web pages out there that I have… you’ve probably run across old forum posts from 2007 where people are talking about using “Italian 00 flour” as part of the secret… I can’t help but wonder if the type of yeast they use is a factor as well. I’ve heard old guys say it’s the water but that’s been disproven pretty convincingly.
So did this come close for you?
I’ve been looking at this thread for a while, I also have fond memories of bulkie rolls from my youth. This is the third go round. Not perfect, but they have a nice crust. They get better every time. I bake them in a cloche, because I have a gas oven that just doesn’t hold steam.
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Oh yeah! Those look spot on 
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@daf, I know exactly what you are talking about. Although I grew up in Chicago, not NY, we used to get hard rolls at the local bakery all the time. Plain ones, ones covered with sesame seeds, poppy seeds, onion, etc. You had to eat them within hours or they would stale. The rolls are made with what the old time bakeries called Vienna dough, which was used to make a variety of breads and rolls. There are recipes for it in George Greenstein’s Secrets of a Jewish Baker and Stanley Ginsberg and Norman Berg’s Inside the Jewish Bakery: Bagels, Rolls & Bialys. Greenstein and Berg were both NY bakers so the recipes should be authentic.
Edited to add that I have made the Greenstein rolls, but not the Berg/Ginsberg rolls. I’m not going to say they are exactly what I remember, but they are close enough where I can chalk it up to slight differences in the the recipe and the skill (or lack thereof) of the baker 
. The ones in my memory had an airier crumb than the ones I produced.
to all,I have been using everything I have seen here and I am happy tosay they are doingwell. I have a h as rd time break doew some of them and every time I makesome they get better. even the o,e that camefrom an old beaker that worked at same. I will be post my newest if the fourm stays up with activity. get we need to hear from someone about that. I have been working on it but have not posted the on fomation, is everyone i,terested??? If yes the I will do my best in posting it soon. but please don’t yell if I post something two or more time.
daf
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Definitely interested!
I just found this thread and I’m very interested to hear about and try your recipe!
Yup, me too!
Very interested