I have tried to make your bagels twice now with little success. Both times I think they have possibly been overproved and when they go into the water to boil, they fluff up nicely and then collapse into slimy pancakes. Is there any chance you can suggest a rough timespan for each stage as I think I’m leaving them too long after taking them out the fridge in the morning as they hadn’t risen much after an hour. Also I’m in the UK and I don’t know where to get high protein flour so I’m just using strong bread flour. Is this possibly part of the problem too? I’m struggling to attach photos to this post to show what going wrong as says files too big
What you describe does indeed sound like over proofing. It’s hard to get more specific than what’s in the tutorial with regard to proofing times since even a few degrees difference in room temp or 1-2 degrees difference in refrigerator temp can make a pretty big difference in overall proofing times. So much of bread baking is reliant on visual cues which can take time (ie trial and error) to learn to read. In the case of the long and multi step process of making bagels, it can be aggravating going through repeated fails. I can’t even venture a guess as to how much to tell you to cut back on proofing times and at what stage. As for the type of flour used, your strong bread flour is fine to use.
I made these bagels today, as written. I did not use the starter or bolted flour, though I will give it a try in the near future. I am in love with these bagels. They turned out fantastic. I have tried a few other recipes, but I like this one the best, thus far. I am in the process of nursing a starter and as soon as it is ready, I will be trying that version as well. Thanks, and the bagel boards are a game changer.
Eric, just wanted to thank you again for the Bagel Recipe. It has always produced superior results for me…Here is the result this morning (along with some Sourdough bread loaves). My family can’t get enough of these bagels, It it was up to them, I would be making bagels every weekend.
@Kevscott I’ve never made bagels before but your photo here inspired me to look at the recipe and I’m so doing this for the holiday breakfast where my family usually has bagels and lox.
I’m curious, have you or @eric ever made them without the overnight cold proof. I’m an early riser, holiday breakfasts in my house can be quite late, and my refrigerator tends to be very full this time of year.
So, I was thinking I could use a hefty amount of sourdough starter for flavor, but do everything the same morning with a 1-1.5 hour room temp final proof. I calculated that for 18 bagels, I’ll need about 5 hours (being generous and ambitious at the same time lol): 30 min measure and mix, 1 hour first rise, 30 min roll/shape, 1.5 hour second proof, 1.5 hour two rounds of boil and bake).
I’ve never tried them without the overnight slow proof, and I would certainly defer to Eric as the master of making bagels. But I wouldn’t hesitate to give your plan a try. I have tried these both with and out the addition of the starter. They were great both ways. The overnight proof is a flavor development step that really adds to the flavor profile (I do it with my breads too).
I would suggest you use the Yeast that Eric Specifies (Bioreal Organic), I think its fantastic and I believe it enhances the the flavor of anything you use it for. I use it now for all my “yeast” baking projects, preferring it over any of the brands available at the local food markets.
Be sure to post your results, I’d love to hear about your experience.
Thanks for sharing your tips about the flavor enhancement and the yeast. I have Saf Active, Saf Instant and Bioreal (…that full fridge I mentioned lol).
I’ll play around with my timing and let you know how it goes.
From those photos, it’s apparent to me that I ain’t got nuthin on ya, Kev. Wow, nice. Reminds me that I HAVE to get some more going asap. I think I see some Yecora Rojo flour bagels in my near future. Melissa, the overnight proof makes a difference but, imo, not enough miss out altogether if you can’t work it in.
Finally getting around to making bagels; I made bagels once with a friend about 20 years ago and had great success. They were a homely lot, but quite delicious. The dough for the current crop is rising in a bowl. They are half bolted, sprouted hard red spring wheat (Breadtopia, of course) and half bread flour.
I do not have bagel boards. Does anyone have any suggestions for how to bake them without boards? For instance, should I flip them in the oven after a few minutes? Seems like it might be tricky. Should I bake them on a cookie sheet, and not bother to flip?
I have made 3 batches in the last few months and in general have been happy with them. Our local bagel place is closed due to the coronavirus and our freezer supply was getting depleted, so I took on the challenge and learned I liked the process.
I don’t have bagel boards. I have a Fibrament stone that I heat to 450F (checked with an infrared). I have a pizza peel (about the width of the stone) that I cover with a piece of parchment. After I boil the bagels and put the toppings on, I put them on the peel (topping side up) that I then slide onto the stone. I can only comfortably fit about 6 or 8, so it means two batches. I do not flip them, but I do rotate the parchment half way through. (The bagels I make are on the small side: 95g of dough each.)
I suppose I could try flipping them by sliding the parchment back onto the peel half way through, removing from the oven, flipping them and returning the oven. (All that so as to not leave the oven door open.) So far I haven’t felt the need to try that.
In an effort to bake them all at one, once I tried preheating a baking sheet on the bottom rack, under the stone, and slid a few bagels on parchment on it, just to see. They didn’t bake nearly as nicely. The stone really adds something.
I learned the hard way a few years ago that the biggest mistake I could make was to overproof them! They completely deflated when boiling, and never recovered. So, as usual, better to underproof than overproof!
I posted already in the Bakers’ Gallery, but wanted to post here too - followed this recipe using half-bread flour, half-sprouted hard red spring wheat (from Breadtopia) that I milled fresh in my Mockmill 100 (from Breadtopia) and bolted/sifted with a 40 mesh screen (from Breadtopia, obviously!). I made 9 in total – four with sesame or poppy seeds, the rest plain. I think I like the plain ones the best. But overall – these were fantastic, and I will definitely make these again.
My husband said these are the best bagels he’s ever tasted. Not too shabby!
Sorry if you’ve already talked about this option, but since my fridge is small, I can’t proof shaped bagels on trays overnight.
So, I’m wondering if you’ve tried something like mixing the final dough in the evening, letting rise an hour at room temp, then BULK fermentation overnight in the fridge, followed by shaping in the morning?
I’m pretty sure it will work, especially with a starter slurry as you do, but maybe a little less yeast to retard things further?
Anyway, just curious what your take would be. Thanks for all the good work!
Holly
Funny but I just asked this same question the other day on another post. I’m planning on making bagels very soon and will be putting the dough in the fridge and shaping in the morning. I’ll let you know how it works out!
I made bagels this morning and they are delicious; they baked up plump w/nice oven spring. I used high protein bread flour and about 75g red fife whole wheat unbolted. I also used Eric’s sourdough slurry as in the video cause I always have active starter around.
Here’s what I think the trade off is though: when you shape in the morning, you’re way less likely to get the big holes Eric’s have, because however gentle you are, you’re deflating the dough while shaping & you only have a short window after that before they’re ready to boil. Because I had levain added, I felt like I had a little wiggle room and I let the shaped bagels rest covered for an hour before boiling. Even with that hour + the sourdough, my crumb was still fairly fine throughout. They did not deflate at all by the way, and floated immediately at the boil.
Still a great chewy texture and flavor though, & since putting trays in the fridge is just not an option, I’m happy with the final product. SO much better than store bought!
Good luck!! image|640x480
