Artisan Rye & Round Romertoph

(Dennis McCanna) #1

I have made Eric’s Artisan Rye several times and love the bread but do not get the rise (I think) I should.
I use Breadtopia’s round 8" banneton which the description says a 1.5 to 2# loaf. It appears that the oven spring is consumed in spreading out to fill the 10 " Romertoph. I keep thinking that these 2 items are a miss match as I BELIEVE the 10" Romertoph should have between 4 to 5 cups of flour.
I am using whole wheat instead of the part bread flour in the recipe but I do sift out the big bits. The crumb has plenty of holes (not huge) and the texture is perfect. It comes out of the baker about 2" in height maybe slightly more.
In the last loaf I added a teaspoon of instant yeast but it did not make a difference in the rise.
I have thought about making the loaf slightly larger to get the rise in the baker but then will it be too large for the banneton?

I am new to this so I am in a learning curve.


(Melissa) #2

Have you tried a cold final proof, either long and entirely in the refrigerator, or you can do room temperature for a while and then a couple hours in the refrigerator.

The point would be to get the dough cold so that’s a bit stiffer. When you load it into your baking vessel, this gives it a slightly better chance of growing up instead out out, in my opinion.

1 Like

(Liz) #3

I make the Artisan Rye fairly often and use a mixing bowl in place of a banneton and a 3 quart cast iron dutch oven (9.5 at top and 7.5 on the bottom), so a bit apples and oranges per your question. However, I do as @Fermentada suggests: a cold final proof. I score cold which works better with the rye I believe and into a preheated dutch oven. It rises nicely with good oven spring. I start at 500F for 5 minutes and then down to 475 for 25 minutes before taking the lid off. 10-15 minutes lid off depending how it looks.

Just this past weekend, I used the Breadtopia oblong baker and banneton and I got a nice rise in that combo, again cold final rise (overnight in the refrigerator).

To be clear, I mix all in the morning, leave it at room temp all day (rt at my house is 62-65F), then preshape, shape in the evening … into the banneton or bowl and then into the frig.


(Paul) #4

In case you are thinking that’s a minor difference, it’s not. In terms of dough integrity (not spreading out) and rise / oven spring, the difference between a white bread flour and some unspecified “whole wheat” flour is somewhere between big and huge.

Try it once with white bread flour where you are using whole wheat and see whether that makes a difference with your process and equipment. If it gives you a better rise that way, then if you want to make the recipe with whole wheat flour, you’ll know that you need to modify your process to accommodate the whole wheat flour.

A variety of possible modifications come to mind, including what @Fermentada and @easummers already suggested, along with changing the hydration (try going dryer), and changing the proofing time (try going shorter).

In addition, which whole wheat flour you are using also really matters a lot. A whole grain hard red wheat is one thing, but a whole grain emmer or einkorn is a totally different thing where rise is concerned.


(Liz) #5

Oh boy … I did NOT register the sub of whole wheat. So another difference in what I do vs @DennisM is that I DO use bread flour (Bob’s Red Mill Artisan). Bob’sRM Artisan is high protein plus has malted barley flour added which helps with rise I believe. *** I think many flours labeled Bread Flour have malted barley so I don’t mean to imply that that addition is unique to Bob’s.


(Dennis McCanna) #6

Appreciate the comments and YES I did use Einkorn as the whole wheat additive (did cause issues in other bakes before). Used Turkey Red today and will try the suggestions and see how it goes. Did make the loaf slightly larger today so I will use something other than the banneton. The cold final proof I didn’t think of. Thanks all for your time.